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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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 Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:25 am Post subject: |
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| QwkTrip wrote: | | So let me ask how many of you have actually driven a car with an extremely well built auto and 3500+ RPM converter? It is definitely interactive. And it ain't your granny's tranny. I don't think a manual ever put a smile on my face as large as the first time I felt a car respond to a high quality torque converter. |
My dad's lowered '85 Chevy SWB, despite being quite slow (15.8@87 in the quarter) has a high stall and a mildly built Turbo 350. I know this isn't apples to apples with a high-hp car and a built auto w/stall. The truck is fun to drive and launch for a while, then it just gets annoying for me. It feels like driving a CVT, in normal driving it doesn't hit the stall speed so shifting, acceleration, everything always feels really mushy. Then when the novelty of driving with a high stall wears off, it gets really boring to launch and go fast as well, since driving it is never more interactive than "push pedal rev up and go" from any speed. It works pretty good for light towing since you don't have to wait for a kickdown to get some torque on a hill or something, just mash the pedal and go. 
Nobody is going to talk you out of doing what you want to do since we're all different and what one person likes has no bearing on what another likes. It should help you decide since you had a couple fourthgens with each drivetrain. I went through a built auto phase a while back and finally slapped myself mentally and decided I was a fool for thinking that.  Driving an auto fourthgen for a couple weeks really cemented the decision for me (even though it was only stock).
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84 Camaro Z28 - LS1/T56
85 Silverado - Low and Slow |
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jchaussee
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Joined: 14 Nov 2010
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Location: renton
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:40 am Post subject: |
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| On a related question for myself. Isn't the cost of getting and putting in a six speed also quite less then building an automatic. And cheaper to fix if things break? |
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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| jchaussee wrote: | | On a related question for myself. Isn't the cost of getting and putting in a six speed also quite less then building an automatic. And cheaper to fix if things break? |
From when I was looking, depending on what kind of parts deals you can find, they are roughly equivalently priced.
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85 Silverado - Low and Slow |
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jchaussee
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Joined: 14 Nov 2010
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Location: renton
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Was that built vs built in the costs?? |
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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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| jchaussee wrote: | | Was that built vs built in the costs?? |
Built 4L60E vs stockish with small upgrades T56. About the same power capacity, but the T56 takes less upgrades to get there.
And the costs I was looking at was with me doing the upgrade labor on each tranny.
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jchaussee
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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| That's good to know. I always assumed the 6 speed would have been a lot less |
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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| jchaussee wrote: | | That's good to know. I always assumed the 6 speed would have been a lot less |
It's pretty hard to do when it seems like every yahoo out there wants $1500 for their bone stock LS1 style T56. I even saw one on c/l the other day where the guy wanted $2500 for just the transmission!
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85 Silverado - Low and Slow |
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Twilightoptics
Hardcore (12sec Club)
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 9191
Location: Auburn , WA
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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I paid 1100 for my ls style.
Thing is, 4L60e needs a brain to run it, so its more expensive when putting it in an older rig.
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jchaussee
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Location: renton
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Well that made my decision easier. My car has no brain. Manual it will be. |
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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Twilightoptics wrote: | I paid 1100 for my ls style.
Thing is, 4L60e needs a brain to run it, so its more expensive when putting it in an older rig. |
True, my pricing included the components to build a MegaShift trans controller in the total cost. I think you got a hell of a deal at $1100 for the LS style. Demand keeps going up and people start thinking the T56 is worth it's weight in gold.
Basically:
T56 and nice clutch + shift forks and synchro pads
4L60E with Dana ProBuilt street/strip kit, fancy torque converter and MegaShift
When I priced out both options I came up to roughly the same cost.
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85 Silverado - Low and Slow |
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Twilightoptics
Hardcore (12sec Club)
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
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Location: Auburn , WA
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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If you include converter in the auto you need to include fly, bellhousing, adapter, fork, pilot, shifter, pedals, hydraulics, etc.
What ate synchro pads?
You only need the $50 3-4 fork, and bronze shift fork pads are a good investment.
Glad I kept my trans then. Lol.
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aaron_sK
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Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 8834
Location: Back in beautiful Tacompton
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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Alphius
Peanut
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 2429
Location: Grand Mound
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't include shifter/pedals/flywheel etc. because I already have all that stuff.
I meant shift fork pads. Misspoke.
I don't have a complete line-item analysis. The general cost between the two for me would have been roughly equal unless I got a screaming deal on some expensive part of the swap.
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85 Silverado - Low and Slow |
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QwkTrip
11sec Club
Joined: 17 Feb 2004
Posts: 3942
Location: Peoria, IL
1989 Pontiac Firebird
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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| My particular T56 setup (trans, clutch, bellhousing) is twice as expensive as the auto. Although, I got it free with wheeling and dealing. |
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Twilightoptics
Hardcore (12sec Club)
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 9191
Location: Auburn , WA
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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iS THAT EVEN ls?????
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QwkTrip
11sec Club
Joined: 17 Feb 2004
Posts: 3942
Location: Peoria, IL
1989 Pontiac Firebird
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Viper-ish, LS-ish. Remember, it was in a 1000 RWHP car. The clutch by itself is $1300. |
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jchaussee
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Joined: 14 Nov 2010
Posts: 1318
Location: renton
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| 2500 for a tyranny. Funny. Could buy a wrecked z28 for about that. |
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Twilightoptics
Hardcore (12sec Club)
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 9191
Location: Auburn , WA
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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Viper is considerably different inside. The tails and mainshaft interchange, but it's not as similar as people give it credit.
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QwkTrip
11sec Club
Joined: 17 Feb 2004
Posts: 3942
Location: Peoria, IL
1989 Pontiac Firebird
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| It is an LS with some Viper parts and other upgrades. |
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aaron_sK
Member
Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 8834
Location: Back in beautiful Tacompton
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Twilightoptics wrote: | | iS THAT EVEN ls????? |
No it is LT1. Notice the mount for the slave cylinder. |
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